An occupational therapist explains meaningful postpartum support | Emily Ecklund

[00:00:00] Ty Hagler: Welcome to the Advancing Maternity Care podcast. I'm Ty Hagler, Chief Operating Officer at Couplet Care. In this podcast, we invite maternal, infant, and family health thought leaders to share their perspectives and work. Today, I'm excited to speak with Emily Ecklund. She's an occupational therapist and patient advocate with nearly a decade of clinical experience spanning direct rehabilitation, program design research, clinical instructor, and academic research. She currently serves as an occupational therapist within the UNC Health System in Chapel Hill. Emily earned her Master of Occupational Therapy from Loma Linda University, where her early research focused on establishing structured daily occupations for highly vulnerable populations, from sex workers to sex trafficking. Emily has a passion for occupational justice, ensuring patients have the autonomy, environmental support, and physical capacity to engage safely in the vital daily routines. Emily now brings her unique occupational therapy perspective and deep commitment to underserved populations to her role as clinical founder of Lauter & Company, addressing an unmet need for dignified mobility and meaningful engagement in users' daily lives. of patient care and advocacy, Emily is a wife, a friend, a mom to two busy littles, often sipping coffee and playing outside. Emily, I'm so glad you joined us on the podcast.

[00:01:28] Emily: Thank you for having me

[00:01:30] Ty Hagler: yeah, just that image of the littles sip- like s- calmly sipping

[00:01:33] Emily: Yep.

[00:01:34] Ty Hagler: outside,

[00:01:35] Emily: Always. Yep.

[00:01:36] Ty Hagler: the

[00:01:37] Emily: Yep. Always being caffeinated.

[00:01:40] Ty Hagler: I 100% agree. Here's my

[00:01:42] Emily: Cheers.

[00:01:43] Ty Hagler: Cheers. So to start with, so Emily, when you and I met, you made a comment 'cause you had figured out and found out about Couplet Care, and you asked me a question if an occupational therapist had been involved with the origin story for Couplet Care.

[00:01:58] Emily: Yes

[00:01:58] Ty Hagler: And it just, it was a unique moment for me.

[00:02:02] Ty Hagler: Do you mind sharing how an occupational therapist would be thinking about this space that we're in?

[00:02:08] Emily: Absolutely. Yes. I, I was stalking the Trig website and found this beautiful bassinet that I had never seen before, and went down the rabbit hole of looking at couplet care and what is this new device doing. And the reason why I automatically was like, "I wonder if an occupational therapist was part of this," is 'cause it is so occupation-centered for the mom and baby.

[00:02:42] Emily: The, the baby's main occupations are feeding and sleeping and engaging with mom, especially in those first few hours and days. And then for mom to be able to provide for baby and to care for herself, and to have as little barriers between her and baby. And so when I saw how this device seems to take away some of those barriers that can be really challenging in your postpartum fog, and trying to recover, and wanting to be as close to your baby, I-- it's just the perfect OT-esque, bassinet twist.

[00:03:29] Emily: And so that is where I was curious about your, your coming across different occupational therapists or if you were familiar with, anyone's work in, in design around devices that wasn't OT.

[00:03:48] Ty Hagler: Okay. Well,

[00:03:49] Ty Hagler: do you mind just kind of for anybody that hasn't worked with an

[00:03:52] Emily: Yeah

[00:03:53] Ty Hagler: just kind of what is, what is the, is the care practice? How, what is the day in the life of an occupational therapist?

[00:04:03] Emily: Yes. So right now it looks very different depending on the setting that the occupational therapist works in. So at the hospital, it can look different than in school-based. But in the hospital, I work with adults, and we are mostly working on maintaining or regaining their activities of daily living, so being able to feed themselves, dress themselves, toileting, bathing.

[00:04:28] Emily: And then once you have the basics, then it's engaging in roles and routines that are important to them. So everything is customized to what is their occupation, what occupies your time. So with my adult post-trauma patients, depending on what limbs are injured or if they have a brain injury, it can be how can they still maintain this role in their life and be able to do the things that are important to them.

[00:05:03] Emily: And so in schools, that can look different with pediatrics, 'cause pediatrics, their, their main work and their occupation is play, and then to slowly start to be able to, to learn, and their work is more academic. But really with the littles and, and my specific littles, their, their daily occupations are to start learning to care for themselves.

[00:05:30] Emily: But also play is so important, and sometimes we as adults don't realize how much benefit comes from the organic play that kids participate in.

[00:05:46] Ty Hagler: So, and you, it seems like you have a way of breaking down, you know, kind of by occupations what each person, like day in the life

[00:05:54] Emily: Yeah.

[00:05:55] Ty Hagler: right?

[00:05:55] Ty Hagler: is, I mean, from a postpartum standpoint, maternity standpoint, I mean, do you, how do you envision or think through like the occupations there?

[00:06:05] Emily: Yeah, I, I think about the easiest way I typically get a pulse on someone's specific occupations are just simply asking, "What is a day in the life-- what's a typical day for you?" For a patient. And you find out pretty quickly if they're a mom, if they're a dad, if they're, a caregiver for a loved one, if they have to drive two hours to go to an appointment, if medical appointments are important, if...

[00:06:39] Emily: So, I feel like that has been an easy tool of seeing what occupations might be inhibited or, or maybe someone has too many... One occupation, they have to go work at their job for 10 hours a day, and then they're deprived in s- other occupations. Like, they want to be, with their kids, or they don't have any leisure activities, which also are life-giving.

[00:07:09] Emily: So, it's kind of finding this balance of the work-life balance and what are occupations that are life-giving to, to people, which is different for everyone.

[00:07:23] Ty Hagler: Yep. Yep. And so, that's, really interesting to hear how you break that down. I think, as we were talking before, you said you wanted to kind of translate some of that, but also that you had a, you know, kind of as you were running across the Couplet Care, bassinet, that you also thought it might be helpful to share your birth story and kind of if you're willing to share kind of how you're connecting these ideas

[00:07:46] Emily: Yeah, absolutely. So with my first pregnancy, I was in California. I was looking at a hospital there, and ever since I was younger, I wanted to be a mom. And so I was very thankful when my husband and I were pregnant, and I was looking forward to the day. And I wanted to prepare for this 'cause I had never seen a birth.

[00:08:12] Emily: I had heard a few stories, but I was also one of my first friends, and my sister hadn't given birth. So I signed my husband and I up for an eight-week... It was two hours every week at this lady's house, and we learned so much about birth, and I am so grateful for her wisdom and those classes and that it was mom and partner, and how much I learned and my husband learned in preparing for our birth.

[00:08:46] Emily: And in that journey, I was hesitant about the hospital birth. I saw the beauty and heard the beauty of what a community birth or home birth could look like for a low-risk pregnancy. But with insurance, it was gonna cost thousands of dollars more to have this community birth, whether it was gonna be a birth center or a home birth.

[00:09:13] Emily: And so my husband des- husband and I decided to move forward with the hospital birth and just have the best team possible, and for him and I to be in the best place possible And I think some of our hesitations around the hospital experience were the, the perceived barriers of physical barriers and potentially pharmaceutical barriers, or just comfort of being in such a vulnerable place, and then being in this very foreign environment, and sterile, and so many people that you've never met before.

[00:09:58] Emily: And so we, we hired the doula to be the one who's been through a birth before and to be our advocate, that she knew us before I started labor. And so-- And then we had a great OB who was open to different laboring positions and delivery positions, and I'm so thankful for my... I had my birth plan, which I'm sure healthcare providers, specifically nursing, probably have challenges with at times.

[00:10:37] Emily: But I'm very grateful they respected those and thankful to our birthing team. And I was able to have the, the unmedicated birth that I had hoped for, and that I had worked really hard at maintaining a mental space for, educating myself on, reading books. And I also wanna emphasize, my husband and I was very much a team, which I am very thankful for, because it is a very trying time and fatiguing, and to have that, that coach and that team player is...

[00:11:20] Emily: I, I'm so thankful for that

[00:11:24] Ty Hagler: That's awesome. But unmedicated birth? Wow

[00:11:27] Emily: Yes, I, and I, I, I don't really want it as, like, a badge of honor. It just really is when looking at the positives and negatives of different potential pharmaceutical interventions or analgesics, and I really wanted to breastfeed as well. I really wanted that to be part of my story and my son's story. And so to me, the potential risks of a little bit of pain decrease, it, it just, the positives of n- not using that outweighed the, the negatives of the temporary, intense pressure.

[00:12:18] Emily: Yeah, that's what I told myself.

[00:12:20] Ty Hagler: Okay. All right. Which

[00:12:23] Emily: It worked twice.

[00:12:25] Ty Hagler: Okay. And you came out on the other side of it both times.

[00:12:27] Emily: Yes, but I do remember I went to stand up after giving birth to get into the transport wheelchair, and I literally almost fell. I was so weak. I didn't realize how much your body had been working for hours, you know, at 10-plus hours. So, but then I think then that night, I remember I had an amazing postpartum nurse in the mother-infant unit who understood that I wanted baby with me as much as possible, and I was hesitant of that plastic container that's so sterile, and baby's used to being warm, cozy, constantly feeling this rocking, constantly hearing my heartbeat, to then laying in this tub next to me, and this nurse was a gift, and she was so sweet to help facilitate safely baby being with me as much as possible.

[00:13:40] Emily: So I think then fast-forward to seeing the couplet care bassinet, I think that also pulled at my heartstrings of,

[00:13:53] Emily: yes, visually it is so much better, but also how beautiful that can be to just go across my lap or across mom's lap, to not have to physically get up every time. And it's not that I don't want mom to get up, 'cause she will get up. But I don't think she would have to physically get up every time she wanted to feed baby.

[00:14:14] Emily: But she will get up to go to the bathroom and to stretch her legs. Her, her body will know when to do that, so I'm not as concerned that this is gonna hinder some type of moms aren't gonna get out of the bed now. So

[00:14:30] Ty Hagler: Y- yeah, we've, we've heard that every now and then that some, like, some hospitals w- would object to the bassinet because they're worried moms won't get out of bed.

[00:14:40] Emily: Yeah, no. They, they will, they will get out of bed. And I also was looking up, someone had made the comparison of giving birth and laboring to a marathon, and there's... I think more it's talking about how many calories you burn and what a deficit your body is in physically after this very physically demanding experience.

[00:15:08] Emily: And so I think to have recovery and to have baby breastfeeding, the baby could be on and off you, I mean, multiple times an hour or every, once every hour, but still that's, that's 24 times. Like, she's going to get up to use the bathroom, to brush her teeth, to sit at the edge of the bed to feed herself. So I, I think it would just be beautiful and a more seamless transition to home as well.

[00:15:43] Emily: When you're at home, you're not going to have a plastic container that is fixed in one position. It's gonna be a lot more fluid, and I think it is a, a beautiful addition to the, to the postpartum world

[00:16:01] Ty Hagler: Yeah. Well, and thank you for that. I think you mentioned you had, of course, you have two children, right? And so was there some differences between the two different, I guess, care practices you delivered at?

[00:16:11] Emily: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:16:34] Emily: So with my second birth, we were out here and in North Carolina, and I was able to have a community birth with midwives at a birthing center. And it was a, a lot less barriers with feeling, a sterile environment. It was more of a bedroom atmosphere, and they were comfortable with you laboring and giving birth in water, which I was really thankful for because I've always been a water person, growing up in California, and swimming, and surfing, and boogie boarding, and the water is just very therapeutic to me.

[00:16:59] Emily: And I-- being in such intense, pain and pressure, and I felt like that could be a great birthing place for myself. And so I was able to do that with the midwives here, and I think postpartum, I didn't have to change rooms, which was very beneficial. And then we got to go home a lot faster than the hospital as well, which, I'm thankful for.

[00:17:32] Emily: And I'm trying to think of the bassinet at the-- if there was any type of... I'm sure they had a surface, but yeah, there was no, like, bassinet or place where you place the baby. I think baby was just on me or with dad until four hours later, we were driving home

[00:17:54] Ty Hagler: Wow. Okay. That's such a shorter time period than I think the... I think it's like two days I
[00:17:59] Ty Hagler: Yeah.

[00:17:59] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. So I, I was thankful for being able to make sure we're stable, and then to come home and, and be with our son, and to just start our new rhythm with baby girl. So

[00:18:19] Ty Hagler: That's awesome.

[00:18:19] Emily: yeah

[00:18:20] Ty Hagler: I think you mentioned maybe with your son that you had the wonderful postpartum nurse,

[00:18:25] Ty Hagler: of course you were getting up to access your son what sounded like 24 times a day just about, right?

[00:18:33] Emily: Yeah, it was a lot. It was all a blur. I-- A lot of the birthing classes were also in prep for breastfeeding and lactation, and so I think I... He-- Baby was with me as much as possible, and then also trying to start caring for myself. So I didn't take a shower, 'cause I think I was still too weak for that, which...

[00:19:03] Emily: And it's, like, even just saying that is-- The birthing process is so physically demanding, but walking to the bathroom to use the toilet, to brush my teeth, wash my face, and put on some pajamas and not just be in the hospital gown, and just try and start feeling like myself again

[00:19:29] Ty Hagler: From a occupational therapy lens, I mean, how do you reflect back on that time period and kind of those activities? I mean, have you reflected on that or...

[00:19:38] Emily: A little bit. I have been more, since thinking about couplet care and how this could change postpartum. I think it took a long time to realize that my roles and routines were very different now moving forward, and that I didn't need to get back to how I was. I was just a new Emily, that this is what my life would be like now, and what, learning what motherhood looks like, and then motherhood and being a working mom, and giving yourself a lot of grace.

[00:20:27] Emily: And there were a lot of lonely times, but I think my community with my friends who... And for me, it was just, like, getting out of the house with baby and knowing that you're not alone. That was really, really big for me in the postpartum. And then breastfeeding is just a whole nother journey of providing food for your infant and caloric demands on you, and then your body changing, and then providing for your baby.

[00:21:06] Emily: The, the mind game of is he getting enough? Is he getting too much? So do I need to pump? Do I not pump? Because then if I pump, then I'll produce too much milk. And so I'm, I'm thankful for community. I don't know how people do this alone. I-- we were not meant to do it alone. So I'm thankful for those providers who were cheering for me and for the friends that had me and baby over just to sit in the living room or go on a walk.

[00:21:45] Ty Hagler: Well, I mean, I'm struck by a couple of things you just said. One, that you came out of it a new Emily,

[00:21:50] Emily: Yeah

[00:21:51] Ty Hagler: it, you know, like I think that speaks to how transformative becoming a parent can be with like, you know, what you take on as a

[00:22:00] Ty Hagler: and then I was remembering that you, you and your husband had gone through and very intentionally took an intensive course beforehand to try to, you know, like, "Okay, this is gonna-- I'm gonna learn everything."

[00:22:11] Emily: Yeah

[00:22:12] Ty Hagler: then clearly you get into it, and you still need to rely on your community and your friends and the specialists in order to help you

[00:22:19] Emily: Yeah, I know. I, I, it's crazy how much you don't know, but at the same time, I'm kind of thankful that I didn't know everything 'cause it is a lot.

[00:22:30] Ty Hagler: Uh-huh

[00:22:31] Emily: but when I... I love talking to first-time moms in their pregnancy and encouraging them and talking about... And I don't think birth is just a thing to get through, that we just need to get to the other side.

[00:22:48] Emily: And culturally, and in our society, and if you watch movies, it's, like, the lady screaming on the bed, and there's a lot of fear around it. And I would love to see that changed for my daughter and for even my coworkers and my friends that are first-time moms. Like, yes, it's gonna be intense, but not everyone gets to experience this.

[00:23:17] Emily: Not, not everyone gets to be supported in this, and there are so many beautiful things that can happen in the birthing story, and we don't just need to get to the other side of it

[00:23:33] Ty Hagler: Yeah. Do you experience it as a series of moments, not just something you're waiting to get on the other

[00:23:37] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. To try enjoy the process seems a little steep, a little... Just to savor the process, I think, and to be present as much as possible in those moments

[00:23:54] Ty Hagler: Yeah. Well, I mean that, I mean directionally, it, it kind of as we're kind of closing out our conversation

[00:24:00] Emily: Yeah

[00:24:01] Ty Hagler: From your lived experience, what advice would you have maybe for the specialists who are listening to the Advancing Maternal Care Podcast of just, like from your perspective, what could people who are caring for expectant and postpartum mothers and families,

[00:24:19] Ty Hagler: what, what advice might you have?

[00:24:22] Emily: I would say to be a cheerleader, to, to celebrate them and encourage them as much as possible, 'cause it can be a really hard place. And to listen to moms, to ask them, "What is, what is going well, and what are things that you wish were different?" And listening to what they have to say, about their lived experience and their day-to-day.

[00:24:50] Emily: Like, "What's a normal day for you?" And kind of if they're gonna reflect some large imbalance that maybe we could work through and try and balance things out a little bit more. Yeah.

[00:25:04] Ty Hagler: Yeah. Well, it's so great to hear your perspective as an occupational therapist, and I really appreciate you sharing your birth story with us.

[00:25:13] Emily: Absolutely

[00:25:14] Ty Hagler: something that's like, it's like one of those moments that, like, reflect back on your life and, like, this is one of those, like, key, like, highlight moments in your

[00:25:25] Ty Hagler: Thank you for sharing that.

[00:25:27] Ty Hagler: is there anything before we sign off, anything that you'd wanna make sure that you share or I haven't asked you about?

[00:25:34] Emily: I would say if there's any occupational therapists or friends of OTs out there hearing this message, that you would encourage them to look into potentially collaboration with product design and industrial design, or seeing where there's unmet needs or areas in devices or environments that can be adapted into...

[00:26:02] Emily: feel free to reach out to me, and I can link email or say email.

[00:26:11] Ty Hagler: absolutely share your email

[00:26:13] Ty Hagler: that, we'll put that, or maybe reach out to you on LinkedIn as

[00:26:16] Emily: Yeah. LinkedIn. Yep

[00:26:17] Ty Hagler: before, before we sign off, we didn't, I didn't actually ask you about your Lauter and Company. Do you mind sharing a little bit about what you're up to there?

[00:26:25] Emily: Yeah. I-- So ever since the start of working in the hospitals and working with various mobility devices, I have seen very little progression or identity in these devices. And so I am working towards a more dignified mobility experience for users that they would not be ashamed of, and that they would be able to confidently still move in the later years of their life or after trauma or surgery, that they would have options in devices to use

[00:27:12] Ty Hagler: Yeah. Very good.

[00:27:13] Emily: Yeah

[00:27:13] Ty Hagler: so if somebody wants to reach out to you about that, it sounds like we'll share your email and

[00:27:18] Ty Hagler: your LinkedIn profile.

[00:27:19] Emily: Yeah, that would be great

[00:27:21] Ty Hagler: perfect. Emily, thank you so much for joining us here today for the podcast.

[00:27:25] Emily: you, Ty. I really appreciate it.

[00:27:27] Ty Hagler: such a delight to chat with you, and thank you for sharing your stories.

[00:27:30] Ty Hagler: All right.

[00:27:30] Emily: Thank you

Contact information for Emily Ecklund:
Email: info@lauterandco.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emily-ecklund-b5943165/
Company website: https://www.lauterandco.com/